Want to fight agains SaaS then probably you should join this movement

I just found out about this movement and thought it may interest a few of us here.

[freewlcode.com]

--
Yogi Yang

Has anyone tried this approach for purchasing WX Dongles?

[web.archive.org]

I for one have decided to turn my back on WX for the foreseeable future.
If PC soft is now owned by a financial investor, I see the risk that he will simply close it down at some point if his profit expectations are not met.
The risk of being left without support and updates at some point is too high for me.
Our approach is:
- Existing Windows applications will initially be further developed in WD (dongle).
- Future mobile+web projects will be developed in an alternative (which will be the same)
- Existing mobile projects must be ported to another language as quickly as possible.
Even if PC Soft reconsiders its pricing model due to falling sales, I have lost confidence and the risk that my own business will suffer if PC Soft fails is too great.

Greetings

Stefan.

Translated with DeepL.com (free version)

If it is any consolation, I remember reading when I was doing some research on Constellation Software for investment purposes that they had never closed down one of their purchases.
Garry

any one see this

[wisej.com]

it is windev like visual controls and c # code . I havenot really looked at it since it gave me a big error on .net cor 7 use and .net 7 cor eis no longer supported bij Microsoft . But some videos looked promessing a litle bit the windev way 7 tab window for controls code behind in c#

So for all of you that wants to build buisiness app and no other programming ( likemost windev devs anyway i suppose ) this might me something to considder

regards

Join the conversation on Telegram!


Hello to all!

If you'd like to have constructive discussions about a possible switch from Windev or simply learn more about Xojo,
Are you a WinDev user thinking about the future of your applications*?

Worrying about migrating to Xojo, its advantages, limitations, and feedback*?

We’ve set up a dedicated Telegram group for Windev developers exploring Xojo as an alternative. Click here to join the chat, share experiences, and ask questions in real time: https://t.me/+qEzYO-TPgo85ZmRk

FYI:
The goal isn't to criticize Windev, which we all think is very good. The goal is to see if we can do things differently.
And especially if we can move towards other development environments with more favorable licensing and costs for their users.
Because just because we love Windev doesn't mean we necessarily want to become slaves to its new commercial terms.

I would suggest against adopting M$ tool chain.

Check out Genexus - [www.genexus.com]

It will surely interest you as a versatile tool.

The last thing that I would want to use Xojo.

It is so buggy that one cannot build large scale software in it and the API nightmare especially Web API is just unbearable.

And the print engine is a joke.

And it cannot build feature rich mobile app at all. Have burnt my fingers and would advise against adopting it.

I can go on and on....

It would be better to explore and adopt Delphi instead. The have a community edition which is 100% free to setup and use and supports building cross platform app, mobile app, web apps and system drivers also!

--
Yogi Yang

Yogi

I have some real doubts about your comments. Xojo has been around since 1997 (28 years), they have an IDE for all major platforms and can build apps for all major platforms, they have 450,000++ end-users around the world, and claim millions of apps have been built. It connects to all major databases and can run on all major platforms.

It is not conceivable that Xojo is "full of bugs and cannot build feature rich apps" (as per your comments) as it would imply that all these users are clueless developers. How could they have survived if that was the case? I think maybe your comments are either referring to some very old version of years ago or your evaluation is not accurate.

Hi JP,
Probably Yogi is referring to older versions of Xojo - there was a lot of criticism about bugs, the WEB API v1 and the missing Android version in older versions.
Since the WEB API v2 and the release of a stable Android version I don't hear and most importantly I don't see any of what Yogi talks about.
Of course it misses some of the features the newer frameworks offer, for say Android, but so do ALL the development environments that Yogi has suggested from time to time: from Delphi, to Genexus and so on ...

And something that is very important is the cost. I for sure do not want to pay thousand of dollars for runtime costs _OR_ work with very limited, non supported Open Source versions of the products.

Xojo may not be in the same class as Windev - none of what Yogi has suggested from time to time is comparable to WX - but other than your time it asks nothing to try it yourself.

* btw M$ tools - especially now with .net core - are also worth considering.

Regards
Steven Sitas

Hi Steve, I am 99% sure we will be moving to Xojo. I like it a lot, it has some good 3rd party tools, and Im sure it has all the power and functionality that we need. It has a good pedigree.

Cheers

I've been looking at Xojo, and whilst I like what I see it seems to lack basic features such as:

1. Flexbox / Responsive behavior
2. SCM Version control
3. Network capable deployment with automatic updates

Have I just missed these features, or has anyone found workarounds...

Rgds
Paul

I would say forget all those features you have mentioned if you want to go along with Xojo.

Personally I have build 8 commercial app in Xojo and the version that I currently use for maintenance is Xojo 2023 r2.

If you want to continue with Xojo then please do check out available Plugins. You will definitely need to buy a few.

There are many issues with Xojo like...

For example the Print Engine provided in Xojo is a joke. I had to ask the client to purchase OmegaBundle which includes Valentine Reports ADK to get descent printing quality and features.

It lacks many controls that we are used to in WX ecosystem.

I have two more suggestions and that is Rem Object's Elements compilers and B4X (B4J, B4A, B4i).

One final suggestion!! Do not take any decision under pressure or in haste. Spend some time checking out all options that are available in the market from competition and try them out.

Note: There are loads of developers leaving the Xojo ecosystem.

--
Yogi Yang

Yogi,
Xojo is NOT in the same category as WX - nor is B4x
It is great and bomb proof for Android and iOS/iPad apps - complimentary to bigger desktop or web apps.
You cannot make a decent ERP with Xojo (or B4x), nobody says that ...

I would advise developers who are thinking of moving away from WX, to go with more COMPLETE and mainstream tools.
MS Visual Studio / C#/.net core and Delphi are worth considering

Regards
Steven Sitas

SteveSitas Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I would advise developers who are thinking of
> moving away from WX, to go with more COMPLETE and
> mainstream tools.
> MS Visual Studio / C#/.net core and Delphi are

I agree with what you suggested

The conclusion I've come to after looking around at alternatives for development tools, is I didn't sufficiently appreciate WX. Even with the price increase, I feel it still provides good value, is reasonably robust, and provides an admirable and reasonably complete environment for developing cross-platform software in a single, reusable code base.

I still have issue with the new licensing, but as a tool I am inclined to stick with it.

Rgds
Paul

TG group is in French. Does TG offer translation?

Hi Paul

>>I still have issue with the new licensing, but as a tool I am inclined to stick with it.

Agreed.

We have about 10 languages in our stack right now including Delphi, C++, C#, Java etc - you will have to go a long way to beat WX for Web and Mobile and some Desktop. We are using WebDev components and Clarion AnyScreen and consider that we have completely conquered speed and granularity and fluidity for the web. We are back in contention.

I have forty-two years of software development under the belt. Be very careful before jumping ship. It may just be down a cliff. RAD is critical these days. As is scalability and speed of execution. WX is in and among the best on the planet right now.

Still a bit miffed about the new licensing stuff though. Losing access to code is a real issue.

For now, we stick to what we have - using dongles with 2025.

Cheers
André

At least with the Clarion subscription, if you decide to stop subscribing, you are still left with your last update working. You don't lose the ability to work.

>At least with the Clarion subscription, if you decide to stop subscribing, you are still left with your last update working. You don't lose the ability to >work.

Correct. And all other compilers we use.

If there was a failback license, I would happily continue to upgrade all my licenses every year like I did the last 10 years. But without it, I cannot affort to be a hostage of a tool. So I stopped the updates in 2025. Let's hope pcsoft will understand that it is an absolute necessity for development tools...

The new 2026 version is announced on the FR site.
Version 2025 still has many parts from the help file that are not translated into English.
The AI ​​writes non-existent WL commands.

But the SAAS rules seem to remain unchanged.
As long as you pay, you can pretend to be a developer.

Khm !

Maybe take a look at coding with free tools and AI ??

Hello Allard. Yes. Maybe.
I investigate Dart/Flutter for now. Who knows?

I guess everyone here is evaluating their options since the announcement of the new saas model. It's evident that moving from the WX family won't be an easy one. Many of the options that have been suggested and are supposed to be similar to WX are even more expensive. Like someone said, after due consideration, WX isn't so bad after all. Was able to do so much without knowing much of the technical stuff.

Been considering training my old brain to learn something new as suggested by considering the MS route via Visual Studio or an open source route with HTML+CSS+React on the front end, and PHP with Laravel on the backend. One of the things I find not talked about much is reporting and access control....especially reporting. Does anyone have experience integrating reports into web apps? How easy is it to limit menu options based on user settings?

Thanks
issah

Anyone have any idea how many people have joined?

Hi, for them, numbers seem to be irrelevant. They made up a plan and they're staying with it.

Kind regards,
Guenter Predl
gpredl@syspredl.at

I am going to try Lazarus (or the Code Typhon spin) to rewrite an existing WinDev app. For the third time in my career the company controlling a tool has caused major problems with their changes. I really want to leave proprietary tools behind.

Hi,

thank you! Could you keep us informed about your progress with Lazarus? Btw, Mistral KI recommended Lazarus as #6 for switching from WINDEV.

Kind regards,
Guenter Predl
gpredl@syspredl.at

Lazarus isn't even close to being the home screen for Windev.
Same as Code Typhon. Just for fun.
Database applications in the Windev style are very far from serious or a competitor to Windev.
Just like Mr. Predl said. I can't wait to see that application in these tools.

Good luck.