[WD26] UI is completely F&*#ed

Hello

I downloaded V100J and the UI is the same unworkable mess it was in the unfinished versions.
Maybe it just doesn't work in Win7 anymore - I will try it out in Win10 over the weekend.

Ever window I open, opens full size within the main IDE window with no options to make it smaller so I can see more than one window in the IDE window. The only solution appears to dragging the windows out onto the desktop.

The pane that holds the Code,debugger and search icons keeps pushing them from the left hand side to the bottom if I make it narrower than it thinks I should.

They can't possibly have screwed up the interface that much, it must be something in the graphics of my PC or a setting I am missing.

I will submit the mess to tech support to see if they have any ideas.

Regards
Al

Hi Al

Sorry to hear it isn't working for you. Only consolation I can give is that it Win10 it works fine for me. I can have as many multiple panels as I wish in the IDE.

Rgds
Paul

Hello Paul

I have persevered and if I open a window, drag it out side the IDE and then drag it back in it stays in a window and doesn't revert back to taking up the whole IDE pane. Still nowhere near as good as V25 but more workable.

As I have said in the past, at PCSoft there should be huge signs on every wall, on every screen saver, in fact everywhere you look;

If it ain't broken DON'T FIX IT !

Regards
Al

Al,

I agree, the new code windows which automatically dock together etc. is a huge pain in the ass. Much more difficult now to easily arrange windows side-by-side for code comparison (especially nice on a large screen), more difficutl to be able to to easily see several code windows around the screen etc. I hate having to keep on finding the window I was looking at in the list of open windows which are all in the same code window (hidden behind each other). Just a huge step backward for the sake of "technology".

Otherwise I find version 26 pretty good.

Hello JP

I have just loaded V26 onto a Win10 PC and the IDE is just the same horrible mess.

I am just realising that this new IDE is by design !
It is so bad, I genuinely thought it was broken or there was a fault in my PC.

I am staggered that a company from a country renowned for style and elegance, a country that created the Citroen DS - my second car, the Eiffel tower and that incredible Millau Viaduct just down the road from Montpellier could regress so far and produce a UI devoid of even basic usability. The new process is going to take a lot more effort and programming will be just that little bit less enjoyable.

I just hope that, in the same way that I can avoid the IDE ribbon controls, that PCSoft find a way to offer the V25 IDE window interface as an alternative.


In the meantime, I have figured out how to get it to work for me. I just remove everything from the IDE onto the desktop , including the toolbars
As I open window, I drag it out of the IDE window onto the desktop.
I reduce the height of the IDE window to about 2 inches and park it out of the way. I have four screens so this works ok but is still a huge PITA.
I have to keep some separation between the individual windows or the IDE tries to combine them into one window.

The only positive thing I can then say about the new UI is that it remembers all this for the next time I open Windev.


Regards
Al

Hi Al,
did you install the Release version [100 ..] on top of the PreRelease version or did you make a clean install [from the release version]?
At least you installed version 100 - I am still fighting with the installation ...

Regards
Steven Sitas

Hello Steven

It was a clean install of all three products as an integrated package
I did turn off my virus protection software while the install was running.
I did not tick the option to install it respecting the Microsoft conventions.

Regards
Al

Hello

I have a suspicion that PCSoft have taken the easy way out with the new non MDI IDE
WD 24 and WD 25 have problems with Ctrl Z and saving with multiple code windows open and instead of fixing the problem, PCSoft changed the interface to give them more control over the windows.

It is just impossible to believe that they think the new interface is better than the one it replaces.

WD25:
Click on a window in the project explorer and it opens
Click on a control
F2 the code window opens
Click on a different control
F2 the code window opens
Click on a different window in the project explorer and it opens
All the windows are open and controllable, they can be dragged out to the desktop if required


WD26
Click on a window in the project explorer it opens full size in the IDE window consuming all the available space
Click on a control in the window
F2 The code window opens full size in the IDE window consuming all the available space and closing or hiding the parent window
Drag that code window out of the way onto the desktop and click another control in the window.
F2 The code window opens full size in the IDE window consuming all the available space and closing or hiding the parent window
It also closes the previous code window if you haven't dragged it out to the desktop !
Drag that code window out of the way and open another window
That window opens full size in the IDE window consuming all the available space and closing or hiding the other windows in the IDE

All this opening and closing, dragging windows out to the desktop is slower and much more work than previously

Click the Minimize icon on one of the open code windows on the desktop and EVERYTHING disappears.

Count to 10 - that doesn't work so just bang your head against the wall a few times - I have a favorite place for this
Close WD 26 - uninstall it and retreat to WD25

This new interface is insane !!

Is this how it works for everyone else or is my system broken ?

Does anyone think the new interface is better ?


Regards
Al

Al
Not sure that I can really be of assistance to you.
My setup is an 'all singing, all dancing' Dell Inspiron laptop connected to (only) two Dell 27" monitors using their USB-C technology implimentation with all 3 displays are controlled via the inbuilt NVidia graphics.
Also now, being pretty much retired, I have only upgraded Windev to version 26.
This I have updated to the latest release 'j' have first completely uninstalled the pre-release version.

Operationally I am not experiencing any issues.
With the pre-release I did encounter the 'full screen, no buttons' issue but with a bit of jiggering around managed to overcome this.WD26
WD26j has installed with all buttons present and correct.

Clicking on a window in the project explorer opens it full size in the IDE window.
Select a control in the window, F2 opens the code window opens full size in the IDE window hiding the parent window.
Both are available by selection of the tabs on the main window.
This, to me, is how it has operated for quite a few releases.

I found that detaching a window does take a bit of training for windows.
On my first attempt the detached window did open full size and therefore when the code window was detached Windows meerged them into a single 'side by side' display.
On my second attempt I adjusted the size of the 1st window and found that the 2nd code window automatically assumed this size and was displayed independently.
Note that if any window being dragged overlaps one already displayed the Windows will combine them 'side by side'.
What I have noticed is that it is not possible to have the code of a second control of the same window displayed as the detached window is always overwritten with the currently selected control.

This is not the case with procedures or class methods as with these you have the option to 'Edit code in new window' from the drop down menu - sadly no keyboard shortcut for this.
Not entirely without issues - this has to be opened on a clear (the main) screen.
Once fully opened it can then be dragged to another monitor with multiple open windows without merging.
If however this is attempted form a window that is already detached then it behaves as previously described.

All a bit of a pfaff I grant you but once set up it does seem to work without further issues.

Finally I have loaded WD26j onto an old Win7 laptop - no problem with install and appears to run OK but of course I have not been able to try out the multiple window aspect.

This may not help your situation at all but may give some encouragement for you to have another walk into the unknown.
My advice is, as always, if you do not need any of the new enhancements (assuming they have actually been delivered) then stick with what you have.
For my part I am interested in the Modbus feature (works as advertised) so the above was worth the effort.

Best regards

Derek

Hello Derek

Thanks for your observations.
This interface is all brand new for me.
In every version up to and including V25 everything opened up in separate windows inside the IDE which is why this new method is such a huge shock.

Luckily there is nothing I require from V26 so I suppose I will stay with V25 until a new "feature" in Windows breaks it

Regards
Al

Al,

I am in agreement with you. I do not like this new full-screen IDE. I much preferred being able to arrange multiple windows around the screen to suit ME!! - not suit the IDE. Sometimes, often, I would position two code windows side-by-side so I could compare line by line the code in each window. This is much harder to do now. This full screen tabbed design is horrible. I can’t be bothered to go back to WD25 so will just struggle with this new IDE.

And the option of dragging windows of the docked position is very cumbersome and horrible. It is not really an option comparable to the WD25 IDE. I don’t know why decisions like this are taken that are so all encompassing affecting everyone everywhere. I cannot believe a majority of developers thought this was a good idea.

Otherwise I find version 26 works fine for me.

Right click on the yellow tab of a docked window, select "Undock" to get behavior similar to earlier versions.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/09/2021 05:37PM by dmontaine.

Hello All

My last word on this mess.

V26 reached back and broke V25.

I have forgotten about V26 and am back with V25. I realised yesterday that since installing V26, when I double click on a table to edit it and then do the same on another table, the first table closes. This has never been the case with V25, You could always have multiple tables open for edit - very handy for checking the columns between two similar tables.

As this is the exact insane behaviour that V26 has, I thought it might be the cause and it turned out that it was.

I still had a copy of V26 installed but uninstalling it did not fix the issue.
I uninstalled V25, manually edited the Windows registry for PCSoft to remove all references to V26 and V25 and then installed V25 again starting from V25-89f and then V25 - 90f

Now everything in V25 is back to normal.


Regards
Al

If I understood correctly , you're talking about the "Describing a table control" properties screen. I believe the lock icon in the top right part must be unlocked, if you want multiple screens open.

Regards,
Sasha

Well, my 2 cents worth.

It's different - takes a bit of getting used to (an hour or so) - but change is an occupational hazard.

With pining and undocking - I am able to more or less replicate what i am used to but also a number of useful improvements.

Anyway - I'm glad this discussion was here. Made it a bit easier to understand what was going on.

Regards
DerekM

Al Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hello
>
> I downloaded V100J and the UI is the same
> unworkable mess it was in the unfinished versions.
> Maybe it just doesn't work in Win7 anymore - I
> will try it out in Win10 over the weekend.
>
> Ever window I open, opens full size within the
> main IDE window with no options to make it smaller
> so I can see more than one window in the IDE
> window. The only solution appears to dragging the
> windows out onto the desktop.
>
> The pane that holds the Code,debugger and search
> icons keeps pushing them from the left hand side
> to the bottom if I make it narrower than it thinks
> I should.
>
> They can't possibly have screwed up the interface
> that much, it must be something in the graphics of
> my PC or a setting I am missing.
>
> I will submit the mess to tech support to see if
> they have any ideas.
>
> Regards
> Al

But isn't there any menu command to revert to the old IDE UI?

If I remember in previous version when they upgraded from standard toolbars to Ribbon bars there was a menu item we could use to revert back to old toolbar interface.